[slim] The Demise of the Transporter

[rrgmrg]

My Transporter does after 6 years. I missed it so much I shelled out 750
for a NIB black with knob on EBay. When this one goes I suspect they
won't be any more around. Forgive me if this has already been discussed,
but why did Logitech give up on it or at the very least, why wasn't it
picked up by another company? Such great form and function and I suspect
a hefty profit margin as well.

Thanks,

Randy


------------------------------------------------------------------------
rrgmrg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10689
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[JJZolx]

To be honest, the Transporter was an inside joke by Sean Adams, who
chuckled under his breath at audiophiles and the little rarefied world
that they live in. He designed a very nice sounding device, and gave it
an arbitrary price tag. ("Hey Tony, how does $1000 sound? That's
expensive, right?" "Nah, why don't you make it $2000?" "Sure. What the
hell.")

Transporter was never where Logitech wanted to take the product line.
They were hoping for something more mainstream, but could never quite
make that happen financially. If they could have sold a device for $99,
then Squeezebox might still be alive. Unfortunately, they inherited
(bought, actually) an ecosystem that was extremely expensive to
maintain, and way more rickety than they'd hoped.

Forensically, their problem was that they hired a lot guys who
understood the hardware, audio and networking sides of things, but they
pretty thoroughly fucked up the data modeling and (to a lesser extent)
the user interface. If Logitech had immediately made the decision to
port the software to a native Windows application and knocked out a
device for $99, I guarantee the Squeezebox would still be alive today.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[SuperQ]

That's a lot of faith in Logitech management. I bought a harmony remote
on the premise that I could manually tweak config files, and it had a
good, if windows-based UI for configuration. Then they made this
completely shit wizard-based abomination that was nearly force-upgraded
upon me. I still regret buying into the harmony remotes, but the
behavior of the company has convinced me they can't get anything besides
mice done correctly. And even those have issuse, like my wireless mouse
at work still can't correctly report the battery status of a NiMh
battery.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
SuperQ's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2139
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[rrgmrg]

Post by JJZolx
To be honest, the Transporter was an inside joke by Sean Adams,

I totally agree that it was way overpriced, but for an "inside joke"
it's an awesome and innovative product, so much so that I overpaid a
second time. Works great, sounds great and looks awesome in my rack.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
rrgmrg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10689
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[callesoroe]

Post by JJZolx
To be honest, the Transporter was an inside joke by Sean Adams, who
chuckled under his breath at audiophiles and the little rarefied world
that they live in. He designed a very nice sounding device, and gave it
an arbitrary price tag. ("Hey Tony, how does $1000 sound? That's
expensive, right?" "Nah, why don't you make it $2000?" "Sure. What the
hell.")
Transporter was never where Logitech wanted to take the product line.
They were hoping for something more mainstream, but could never quite
make that happen financially. If they could have sold a device for $99,
then Squeezebox might still be alive. Unfortunately, they inherited
(bought, actually) an ecosystem that was extremely expensive to
maintain, and way more rickety than they'd hoped.
Forensically, their problem was that they hired a lot of guys who
understood the hardware, audio and networking sides of things, but they
pretty thoroughly fucked up the data modeling and (to a lesser extent)
the user interface. If Logitech had immediately made the decision to
port the software to a native Windows application and knocked out a
device for $99, I guarantee the Squeezebox would still be alive today.

It was not overpriced. It is worth every penny. Design, build quality,
components, and sound quality all top. So the price is OK.



Callesoroe
Living room: Transporter, Tact RCS 2.2X digital preamp, Martin Logan
Vista speakers, AMPS(Icepower): Acoustic Reality Ear Enigma
PLUS(PANELS), Acoustic Reality Ear TWO MKII(Bas)
Kitchen: Transporter, Prodipe Pro 5 active bi-amp speakers. Bedroom:
Receiver+UE boombox, Kids: Receiver+Active speakers, WIMP-HIFI flac
streaming.
http://www.last.fm/user/callesoroe
------------------------------------------------------------------------
callesoroe's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=22693
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[cliveb]

Unfortunately, they inherited (bought, actually) an ecosystem that was
extremely expensive to maintain, and way more rickety than they'd hoped.

Funny that. I've never had any reliability problems with any version of
SlimServer/SqueezeCenter/LMS. I've run various incarnations on FreeBSD,
Win2000, Ubuntu and Fedora. It always just worked. So I can't understand
where you get your idea of "rickety" from.

Or perhaps you're speaking in terms of the development and support
effort required. I guess that's possible, but I don't have any inside
knowledge of what their software guys had to deal with.

Forensically, their problem was that they hired a lot of guys who
understood the hardware, audio and networking sides of things, but they
pretty thoroughly fucked up the data modeling and (to a lesser extent)
the user interface.

Seems to me that what Logitech actually did was see that there might be
money to be made from the streaming audio market, and so took a punt on
buying a semi-mature technology to try and enter that marketplace. It
only cost what for them was petty cash.

Unfortunately they never understood the Slim Devices vision so had no
idea where to take things. Everyone seems to think that in hardware
terms the Touch was the crowning glory, but it was the beginning of the
end - a "non-slim Slim Device", as it were. By trying to put some of the
intelligence into the player, they completely missed the point of how
the ecosystem was supposed to work. Luckily for customers who did
understand the system, they could ignore the cut-down server they tried
to put on the Touch and just use it as a player. But it was presented to
the mass market as an all-in-one solution, and that just didn't work.

What Logitech should have done is release some sort of LMS appliance so
they could sell a turnkey server and stick with genuinely slim players.
If they couldn't even figure out how to do that, they could have bought
Vortexbox for much less than they paid for Slim Devices.

If Logitech had immediately made the decision to port the software to a
native Windows application and knocked out a device for $99, I guarantee
the Squeezebox would still be alive today.

Perhaps something would still be alive, but it wouldn't be much like the
Squeezebox system we know and love.



Transporter -> ATC SCM100A
------------------------------------------------------------------------
cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[netchord]

i have two, one of which i use via its digital output to a Meridian G61.
i could use a touch for the same purpose, but the transporter looks so
much cooler.

i paid $1300 for one, and $600 for the other, several years apart. the
average seems about right, and it sounds fabulous via its analog outputs
in my main rig.



--
4 TB Drobo-->FW 800-->mac mini-->Ethernet
Transporter--> Wireworld Eclipse 6 coax-->Meridian G61
G61--> Nordost Red Dawn-->Primare 30.3
Primare-->Ocos--Vienna Acoustics Beethoven/Maestro
------------------------------------------------------------------------
netchord's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=21002
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[SamS]

I have two now, bought a spare NIB via eBay for about $500. Cheap
insurance for when one eventually gives up the ghost.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
SamS's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9261
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[cliveb]

totally agree! i believe had the first SB used a native audio driver
for windows, that would have been huge.

Comments like this just go to show how badly some people misunderstand
the Squeezebox ecosystem.

None of the Squeezebox players were ever Windows devices, and the server
software isn't an audio application - it sends packets of data via
TCP/IP to the players. You can run the server on a machine without any
audio devices at all. So where would a "native audio driver for Windows"
fit?



Transporter -> ATC SCM100A
------------------------------------------------------------------------
cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[Mnyb]

Post by cliveb
Comments like this just go to show how badly some people misunderstand
the Squeezebox ecosystem.
None of the Squeezebox players were ever Windows devices, and the server
software isn't an audio application - it sends packets of data via
TCP/IP to the players. You can run the server on a machine without any
audio devices at all. So where would a "native audio driver for Windows"
fit?

Yes that's exactly what squeezebox NOT aspired to be a soundcard with a
long wire :)



--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x
MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3
sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
Misc use: Radio (with battery)
iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
(spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller )
server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[BJW]

Post by cliveb
Comments like this just go to show how badly some people misunderstand
the Squeezebox ecosystem.
None of the Squeezebox players were ever Windows devices, and the server
software isn't an audio application - it sends packets of data via
TCP/IP to the players. You can run the server on a machine without any
audio devices at all. So where would a "native audio driver for Windows"
fit?

i do understand the ecosystem. i have been using this stuff for ~ten
years now.

the things you point out, are things i know and knew and just obvious.
the things i am saying that you are replying to, are things that i
consider to be part of why all this ecosystem died. and just to be
clear, it is dead.

i have np with what exists. my problem is with what they didn't create.
there should have been more focus on the windows market, b/c without
that market, this was never going to be viable. the problem was that
there was too much blind ideology or philosophy involved, basically a
commitment to platform independence above all else, (mainly b/c the devs
were all linux/mac types, and none of them live and work and play in a
windows environment).

what i suggested, (and i did so before this ecosystem died) is that had
they made a windows driver, that then fed a transparent app whose job
was to feed the audio from the driver into TCP/IP to the devices, then
this all might have been viable. the advantage for the user is that
they then could have used any software on the computer they wanted to
use. i for one, find the server to be ridiculously designed, and not
fun to use. that seems to be the sentiment of the market as well.

i could have used winamp to play all my stuff the way i ALREADY was
using winamp. and i can remote control my winamp too, i don't need
server for that. think about it, all the money/resources/time poured
into developing server, which was not a revenue generator, could have
been used elsewhere.

anyway, it makes no difference now if i am right or wrong. but what
must be acknowledged, is what was done, was not the right thing to do.



using: win7 64 + lms 7.9 & duet & ipads w/the logitech app, and ipeng
on an ipod
http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/various_artists_logic &
http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/compilations
------------------------------------------------------------------------
BJW's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=58242
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[toby10]

..... i could have used winamp to play all my stuff the way i ALREADY
was using winamp. and i can remote control my winamp too, i don't need
server for that. .

WinAmp is a server.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
toby10's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12553
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[epoch1970]

what must be acknowledged, is what was done, was not the right thing to
do.

Right. But that's as far as I am with you.
How do you explain Sonos is still in the market? They do market
expensive stuff, and their design is a networked audio system, not a
long audio cable for windows desktops.
In addition, the long audio cable is called Bluetooth nowadays. Logi
sells affordable BT audio devices. Yet they've not taken the world over,
as far as I can see.

(recycling the Transporter... dreadful thing to do.)



4 SB 3 • iPeng (iPhone + iPad) • Squeezebox Server 7.9 (linux) with
plugins: CD Player, WaveInput by bpa • IRBlaster by Gwendesign (Felix) •
Server Power Control by Gordon Harris • Smart Mix, Music Walk With Me,
What Was That Tune? by Michael Herger • PowerSave by Jason Holtzapple •
Song Info, Song Lyrics by Erland Isaksson • WeatherTime by Martin
Rehfeld • ShairTunes2 by disaster123 • Local Player, BBC iPlayer by
Triode • Auto Dim Display, SaverSwitcher, ContextMenu by Peter Watkins.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
epoch1970's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16711
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[Golden Earring]

Hi guys!

Just a quick pointer to my recent thread in the Audiophile sub-forum
under the above heading (it's near the top of page 1), in case you don't
graze there often.

If anyone still wants one, or even a spare for insurance, they're not
over-priced now...

Best regards,
Dave :)


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Golden Earring's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=66646
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[pablolie]

The problem was they only saw value in hardware (selling Transporters or
Touches or Booms), but never realized the software ecosystem was
actually the more valuable asset. I have often said I would have paid $
for an LMS and especially a "Squeeze Slave" agent license. Why that
stuff was always given away defies logic. But many companies don't deal
with the transition from hardware to a software ecosystem.



...pablo
Server: Virtual Machine (on VMware Workstation 12) running Ubuntu 16.04
+ LMS 7.9
System: SB Touch --optical->- Benchmark DAC2HGC --AnalysisPlus Oval
Copper XLR->- NAD M22 Power Amp --AnalysisPlus Black Mesh Oval->- Totem
Element Fire
Other Rooms: 2x SB Boom; 1x SB Radio; 1x SB Classic-> NAD D7050 -> Totem
DreamCatcher + Velodyne Minivee Sub
Computer audio: workstation --USB->- audioengine D1 -> Grado
PS500e/Shure 1540
------------------------------------------------------------------------
pablolie's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3816
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[Hammer865]

GaryM,
Thanks for your reply and I checked that setting and it is pointed at my
Itunes library.
I still struggle with having only my Squeezebox account verified so I
can stream radio, etc, but I when I select "Connect to LMS" to connect
to my PC to be able to stream my ITunes but I get these errors.

Any thoughts?

Your player was not found.

If you own a Squeezebox or Transporter:

Make sure that your player is plugged in and its networking settings
are correct. Click the Refresh button once your player is connected.

FROM THE "INFORMATION" tab, notice "Total Players Recognized: 0" (when
it used to work correctly, this always said "1")


Logitech Media Server Version: 7.7.6 - 1521467459 @ Thu Mar 29 16:46:01
WEDT 2018
Hostname: Terence-PC
Server IP Address: 192.168.0.4
Server HTTP Port Number: 9000
Operating system: Windows 7 - EN - cp1252
Platform Architecture: 8664
Perl Version: 5.14.1 - MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
Database Version: DBD::SQLite 1.34_01 (sqlite 3.7.7.1)
Total Players Recognized: 0


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hammer865's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4386
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[Hammer865]

Transporter

Type: Transporter

Status: Not Connected


so how do I get it to connect?


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hammer865's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4386
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[garym]

Post by rrgmrg
Transporter
Type: Transporter
Status: Not Connected
so how do I get it to connect?

on Transporter menu (unit itself), select "My Music" then it will try to
connect to your local LMS. If you have more than one LMS running
locally, choose the name you've given your LMS music library (in LMS
webGUI, in SETTINGS, Basic Settings Tab, media library name). This will
connect your Transporter to LMS running on your local computer.



*Home:* VBA 4TB (2.4)>LMS 7.9.1>Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio
(ethernet)
*Cottage:* VBA 3TB (2.4)>LMS 7.9.1>Touch> Benchmark DAC I, Boom, Radio
w/Battery (ethernet except Radio)
*Office:* Win8(64) > LMS 7.9.1>Squeezelite
*Wilderness: *PiCorePlayer 4.0 on rPi 3B+, hifiberry Dac+Pro, 4TB USB
(LMS & Squeezelite)
*Controllers:* iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or
SqueezePlay 7.8 on Win10(64) laptop
*Files:* ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes;
Streaming: Spotify
------------------------------------------------------------------------
garym's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17325
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[RonM]

Jeez, Gary, more than 11,000 posts? You are indeed a warrior!

R.



LMS on a dedicated server (FitPC3)
Transporter (Ethernet) - main listening, Onkyo receiver, Paradigm
speakers
Touch (WiFi) - home theater 5.1, Sony receiver, Energy speakers
Boom 1 (WiFi) - work-space
Boom 2 (WiFi) - various (deck, garage, etc.)
Radio (WiFi) - home office
Control - Squeeze Control (Android mobile), 2 Controllers (seldom used),
Squeeze Remote (on Surface Pro 4)
Touch x 1 - spare
UE Radio x 1 - spare
Boom x 1 - spare
Controller x 1 - Spare
Duet Receiver (backup)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
RonM's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17029
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[garym]

Post by RonM
Jeez, Gary, more than 11,000 posts? You are indeed a warrior!
R.

oh my....I spend way too much time in front of a computer.



*Home:* VBA 4TB (2.4)>LMS 7.9.1>Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio
(ethernet)
*Cottage:* VBA 3TB (2.4)>LMS 7.9.1>Touch> Benchmark DAC I, Boom, Radio
w/Battery (ethernet except Radio)
*Office:* Win8(64) > LMS 7.9.1>Squeezelite
*Wilderness: *PiCorePlayer 4.0 on rPi 3B+, hifiberry Dac+Pro, 4TB USB
(LMS & Squeezelite)
*Controllers:* iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or
SqueezePlay 7.8 on Win10(64) laptop
*Files:* ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes;
Streaming: Spotify
------------------------------------------------------------------------
garym's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17325
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[Greg Erskine]

My Transporter died after 6 years. I missed it so much I shelled out 750
for a NIB black with knob on EBay. When this one goes I suspect there
won't be any more around. Forgive me if this has already been discussed,
but why did Logitech give up on it or at the very least, why wasn't it
picked up by another company? Such great form and function and I suspect
a hefty profit margin as well.
Thanks,
Randy

Hi Randy,

There is a thread here discussing replacing failed Transporter PSUs.

Maybe you can bring it back to life?

regards
Greg


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Greg Erskine's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7403
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[rrgmrg]

Post by Greg Erskine
Hi Randy,
There is a thread here discussing replacing failed Transporter PSUs.
Maybe you can bring it back to life?
regards
Greg

Thank you Greg. I'm afraid I already sent it to E Waste. Probably should
have kept it for parts and pursued a repair, it would have been nice to
have a backup.

Randy


------------------------------------------------------------------------
rrgmrg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10689
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431

[riffer]

Post by rrgmrg
Thank you Greg. I'm afraid I already sent it to E Waste. Probably should
have kept it for parts and pursued a repair, it would have been nice to
have a backup.
Randy

Ouch!!

People would have bought it just for a working display and the knob.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
riffer's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13459
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104431